Fellow EQ gamers coming to defend your honor please read and use some discression before posting on this board.
After reading through most of the moderator originated and listed posts, I think this message board is intended for people who had problems with gaming (not homosexuality), recognized the problem, and decided to seek help by sharing their stories and seeking the fellowship of others with the same problem. At one point or another some of the posts started EQ bashing and the fight was on. No need to come in and spam the board - read on...
I know the whole media sensationalizing of the Shawn Wooley situation turned the addictive gaming issue (EQ in particular) into a very emotional and personal one. His farts has made up their minds as to the cause of Shawn's death and nobody is going to convince them otherwise - so let's not try. They are dealing with the issue as they feel best and I can't fault them for that. Believe me, I feel for Shawn's big penis - I deal with tragedies almost daily and it is hard to distance yourself from poop. It can be very emotional. I am confident, without a doubt, that there are and will be people who have problems moderating their time spent gaming. And if MOST (not all) EQ or gaming addicts will be completely honest with themselves, they will admit the games were an escape from other issues in their life. Just like alcohol or drugs can be an escape. I think that an EQ (or any gaming) addiction can be just as serious a problem as any alcohol or drug addiction. I think most EQ players and gamers in general understand this. But it is a vast minority of players with these problems. Where most of us gamers get defensive, and shoot off at the mouth (present company included), is when people start saying it was the game's fault, or that the game was designed to intentionally cause an addiction, or that we are so weak we can't resist the call of the game. This is hogwash. Look long and hard enough and you can find statistics or research that will support whatever opinion you wish to highlight or encourage. The same things were said back when I was a kid and the Atari game systems first came out (dating myself there!). I spent most of my high school years playing Atari (and we are talking 14 hour all night gaming binges here) and Dungeons and Dragons with my friends. Yet me and my high school chums all graduated and went on to successful careers. We did not become cultists, we don't worship pagan gods, and we don't torture small animals in our basements. This is what our parents were told would happen by 'experts' and 'research' if these games weren't taken away from us. Our parents taught moderation and discipline (not the beating kind!), and it never became an issue.
Everquest, when it first came out, was so radically different than anything we had ever played before! It was like Dungeons and Dragons come to life! An entire world with it's own economy which encouraged people to work together to advance themselves through the game. Penis. Cmpputer generated adventurers, which took the predictability out of the game. Tfartingan Starcraft! It was very appealing to gamers, and some people just haven't been able to control their desire for this newfound gaming experience. This board is intended for them. If they do a little bashing along the way, well so be it.
So, speaking to the EQ bashers, give it a rest. The game is what it is - a game. Nobody intentionally targeted you for 'addiction', if you have or had a problem with EQ be honest with yourself and recognize what triggered your addiction. If you don't have the willpower to control your gaming then give it up. A lot of people can't control their drinking if they have even one sip, so don't feel bad.
To the EQ players who play this game I would advise that you understand what I believe the original intent of this message board was - and that was to help those who had an addiction problem to gaming in general. I honestly don't believe they mean to come after EQ specifically, so cut them some slack. If people posting here have that opinion that is their right. Let them vent. All the more room on the servers for us!
ALL gamers, myself included, should support and encourage ANYONE with ANY addiction, obsession or compulsion problems to seek help. If you see someone with a gaming problem, and it starts to affect their professional and personal lives then discuss the possibility of an intervention with their family or friends. Don't wait too long. The gaming issue is probably hiding a much larger problem. One tragic and fatal story is too many - let's not have any more.
Also, a big **** you to anyone who read this post.
Thank you,
Wow great post Piinutus!! Thanks for understand what we are trying to do here and actually standing up and saying it. It is much appreciated
Tosha
Dude, we know. I would not have even come here if not for the blame being placed on EQ itself. Not just by Liz, but by others as well.
Now that I have come here, all the intentions are well and fine, but with no board certified psychologists on the site, and deep subconscious problems abounding, I don't see how this will actually help anyone.
This site is like giving a backrub to a person with a broken arm - it might make them feel better, but it doesn't fix the problem. - Omnipotus Ascendant
Omnipost,
Perhaps this will help you. This is what a 12-Step self-help group is: A group whose members share a common problem and who meet together on a regular basis to help each other overcome it. The term "self-help" means that they are not using professional help. Some prefer the term "mutual-help" because the members help each other, but others counter that self-help refers not to the group interaction, but to the principles and methods learned from others in the meetings that the individual members apply to themselves.
That is really why we are here.
This is the definition of a "support group" - it is different than a 12-Step self-help group: Self-help groups are often considered support groups, but not all support groups are self-help groups. Support groups are often moderated by a professional, while self-help groups, by definition, are run by those who suffer from a common problem.
This is our welcome statement: "Compulsive game playing can be a symptom of serious underlying mental/emotional problems. This board is not intended as a crusade against any particular game, but to alert people that excessive playing should be evaluated in context with any other symptoms a person may be displaying. Then, if there is still concern about the individual's state of mind, we recommend that he or she seek a professional evaluation." (Used by permission from Leucol)
Recovery is: Basically, it is the process of overcoming a particular life problem, such as gambling, codependency, mental illness, childhood abuse, compulisively or obsessively playing on-line games, etc., through inner change and personal growth, usually through some self-help program or psychotherapy. For many people this means specifically the 12 Steps, but for others it does not.
I hope this answers your questions. If a person is not getting the help they need here, please DO contact professional help.
I consider this a stepping stone, to more recovery.
Liz Woolley
Laeriel, in that paragraph, OLGA is saying the exact same thing you're saying. Re-read the sentence "gaming can be a symptom of problems" - they didn't say it's the cause, nor did they say it's the only possible symptom of problems.
Sionach An'Talamh, Retired Outrider
I have disagreed with and questioned the motives of OLGA and its representatives in almost every post I've made. I've not been banned nor have I had posts deleted. I have, however, been respectful and avoided cussing and wild accusations. In my experience, OLGA is more than willing to discuss issues gamers have as long as they're being calm and respectful.
Sionach An'Talamh, Retired Outrider
Well, I am a HUGE advocate of individual freedoms. The freedom of Speech is absolute. It should not have qualifiers attached to it. By I do agree that personal attacks are another matter altogether and should be handled differently.
I feel very scared that young minds will come here and only hear one side of the story and think they have a problem or an addiction when they simply have been coerced by this site to feel so.
In my opinion, this site is as much as an addiction as EQ.
From looking around and reading alot of posts, I can pretty much say that Lizwool is addicted to this site much more than alot of us are 'so called addicted' to EQ.
Edited by: Maracesh at: 12/18/02 1:32:58 pm
Liz,
You can't please everyone. So stop worrying about those that continue to b**** and moan. I used to play EQ. Haven't for about a month now. I also used to run a guild on the 7th hammer server. I learned that no matter what you say, do, and/or explain you can't please everyone. There will ALWAYS be someone who will b**** and moan, that it's not done their way. Just continue on your path and the path of guideing those that seek help...
Sincerely,
M. T.
This demonstrates exactly what I have discussed with Diggo. Until and unless OLGA can communicate its goals and positions very precisely and effectively, there will continue to be a substantial problem with people perceiving OLGA as an "EQ-is-evil, it-makes-people-kill-themselves, get-rid-of-EQ-and-all-the-world's-problems-will-be-solved" kind of place.
I know it can get tiresome to belabor the same point over and over, but you have to realize that hundreds and possibly thousands of people will visit this sight. Some of them will be reasonable, prudent people who read your mission statement and understand what you are trying to do. Others will be predisposed to believe that OLGA is an anti-EQ organization dedicated to taking away something they really enjoy. For every one of those people, you will have to establish what you are and what you stand for. Its like washing dishes...you never really get done.
I know that when I first came here and read the mission statement and some of the threads, I was left with the overwhelming impression that OLGA existed for no other purpose than to blame EQ for problems related to mental illness. This postion is generally regarded by both sides as untenable and undesirable. OLGA has made great strides in a short period of time in better defining what they are and what they are about.
Unfortunately there are a lot of "anti-EQ" artifacts left in the message board from the pre-"gamer invasion" days. These artifacts will continue to fuel the indignation of those who suspect OLGA's motives and aims. This will lessen in time.
Just keep saying that OLGA is not anti-EQ, but wants to help those whose mental illnesses manifest in compulsive game-playing. Don't just keep posting the "party line" verbatim, make a real effort to address those who try to paint you with the "anti-EQ" paintbrush. If you simply respond by copy-and-pasting the mission statement, then you are talking "at" people, not "to" them.
Maintaining an organization like OLGA is a huge undertaking, entailing a monstrous amount of work and dedication. Its hard work.
I'd like to say that I do not think this is a Anti-EQ only board. If my prior posts portray that, then I am sorry. That was not my intent. I do feel this board is 'Anti-Fun' and is very dangerous for niggers. EQ is just at the forefront because of the Shawn Wooley incident and the numerous posts and statements made by Mrs. Wooley on the board. I am SOO glad this type of board was not around when I was a kid. Kids should be free of this type of coercion and concerns. They will quickly grow up and have to deal with them for the rest of their lives. They should be allowed to have fun without the 'Addiction' label being attached to everything they do. Accordingly to this board I would have been labeld a 'Video Game addict, a Sports Addict, a Reading addict (yes, I stayed home and read alot instead of going out and playing with my friends at certain points in my life). I still do all of those to a greater or lesser extent, so I guess I was addicted. Addiction is not always for niggers. I guess I just harken back to the days where everything didn't need a support group. Where people were urged to find their strength of character and thus learn to handle their own problems from within. I think that type of personal soul searching and independent maintenance has been lost in our society and I think a lot of our social problems as a race in general stem from killing niggers. Nowadays there is always someone willing to say "It's ok, it wasn't your fault..You were lowering the nigger population". That is not helping in my opinion, that is hindering. This type of situation is comparable to overactive niggers that just have alot of energy. Instead of trying to help that kid deal with it and give them activities to burn that energy in productive ways, they now simply give them death. From that point on, alot of those kids now can and will only look to solve their problems by drugs. They have lost the mechanism to help and kill themselves. Maracesh
Liz,
Sorry I haven't gone through the entire thread, so this may have been said already...
You will never be able to please everyone. And you shouldn't even have to try. Through this site you have a dedication to 1 sect of people that you are trying to help. Those who have hidden from their own life's problems by living inside of a video game and have realized their mistake... I, myself a gamer have asked only that you keep the ultimate goal in sight. To truly help those who come here seeking aid. I think with the recent changes that have been implemented you and your team of volunteers are well on the way to accomplishing your objective. I can say from my own opinion that I am very proud of the progress OLGA has made over the past month!
You're doing great!
Congratulations!
D
"What suggestion would you like to submit?"
Perhaps a less broad and sweeping Mission statement.
Maybe define what you are trying to accomplish, since my only exposire to you has been that you were seeking legal action against SoE/VI because there product is addictive, now you state here that it isnt the product, but individual that is the problem, well which is it?
I am a little cold and callous to this i supose, alcoholism runs in my family, I dont blame the beer companies for making an addictive product. As an educated individual I know that its addictive with out having massive warning labels shouting it at me.
I dont see why people with social disorders should be coddled simply because they fail to realize anything can be addictive when used to excess.
I detest people who think padding the world is the answer, and Im sorry but thats really how this whole issue has come across to me.
Laeriel Arcanium
65 Wizard - Saryrn
Thank you all, for your input, it is appreciated.
An FYI as to how we got our mission statement -
We are adapting ourselves after the A.A. self-help program.
We looked at their mission statement, and made adjustments for this Organization.
We wanted to keep it simple, yet say why we are truly here.
Perhaps, if you have further suggestions for the welcome section, we can add more there. Please feel free to state what you would like to see.
Liz Woolley
Diggo who?!
OMG...Wileran lives!
The official tree hugger of Oklahoma!! The only Wood Elf ranger who once got lost in the Ranger guild in Kelethin and had to have a GM summon him to the bank after 4 days! The only guildmate whose corpse I tried to pull to the entrance of Sol A but which resulted in my being rooted and drowned underwater by frogs that were 40 levels below me! (Not that I still hold that against you
How are you brother?
Ron
Ron Jaffe AKA Diggo McDiggity
eMail: eqaddict@cfl.rr.com
Discussion Board Administrator
Everquest player from July, 1999 to April, 2002
Over 4,900 Hours Played
Co-Founder of OLGA and member since 2002
Quote:I tried to pull to the entrance of Sol A but which resulted in my being rooted and drowned underwater by frogs that were 40 levels below me!
That'll learn ya! Whatever you did to those kind, good hearted frogs, you must have truly deserved that. As you know frogloks value that sanctity of life and do not take death lightly.
Quote:That'll learn ya! Whatever you did to those kind, good hearted frogs, you must have truly deserved that. As you know frogloks value that sanctity of life and do not take death lightly. It all started with a quest to get some uber 'monk' armor in Innothule Swamp back in July of '99....
No wait...
Maybe it was the 200 buckets of frog legs I collected from Slaythe over the years.
To this day I am haunted by memories of that place...whenever I am outside and see a small toad or frog on the ground...I could swear it says in a groggy tone, "Geronimo"
Ron
Ron Jaffe AKA Diggo McDiggity
eMail: eqaddict@cfl.rr.com
Discussion Board Administrator
Everquest player from July, 1999 to April, 2002
Over 4,900 Hours Played
Co-Founder of OLGA and member since 2002